Re: My doubts about Debian choice

[jfm2@club-internet.fr]

> 
> Just a few thought to  debate JFrancois non-technical viewpoints:
> 
> (1).  IMO, the Debian choice has been the best one:  First  and  not
> least, on philosophical grounds [please, do not tell me 'philosophy'
> isn't  important  to Linux - in many ways, we're all together inhere
> on ideological [not technical]]  grounds;  Second and not last, it's
> also been a very good choice from the 'strategical' point  of  view:
> Debian  is  a  'free'  group  so  far and they seem to keep up their
> approach whereas RedHat is a for-profit endevour which will grow and
> start manipulating code and strategies to defend it's own interests;
> 

Whan I played competition chess it happened me not a few times than I
had a superb strategic plan only than I was crushed a lot before
applying it thaks to brilliant tactic moves of my opponnent.  That is
one of the first lessons you learn: it is the coupling of strategy and
tactics who differentiates a grand master from a normal man.

The fact than RedHat is a commercial vendor has not impeded them
GPLing all what they produce.  It _can_ have influence on what
products they include in the distribution: for instance they could be
shy of including free software competing with Applixware.  But they
have allowed free download of their distribution and seeing part of
their customers buy from CheapBytes thanks to the fact than RedHat is
GPLed.

> (2).  I do not believe Debian is an anarchic group: it just  uses  a
> 'free-will-social-contact'  approach.   This implies that volunteers
> cannot be forced like soldiers  to  do  things they neither like nor
> consider UNimportant.  In this, I'm pretty sure  many  hackers  will

I have seen the Linux-kernel in action and while not forcing anyone to
do anthing Linus will not allow incorporating features than he
considers harmful.

I consider instructive than no _one_ person in a group of
_two_hundred_ has in _four_years_ found important to package a Wysywyg
word processor or the kind of graphical and simple databases a normal
person would use for keeping track of the wines he keeps on his cellar.


> give  **all  they  have**  (time,  energy, will, spirit and more) to
> create packages and  a  system  which  may  be universal (i.e.  used
> along and across the entire planet by people from all  cultures  and
> degrees  of development).  IMO, this is an **historical chance** for
> the Hacker Community: You'll be  able to give tools for development,
> education and research which in _practical terms_ get  converted  to

Listen we are speaking of tools who have not been developped by Debian
but by FSF, by the Linux and XFree group and by thousands of people
who are _not_ related to Debain.


> more  beans  & bread over the table, better life quality, less child
> mortality, better water, less erosion,  more rational use of natural
> resources and much, much more.  What I'm  mentioning  is  neither  a
> movie  nor  an overkill: it is reality.  I've been travelling myself
> over Asia and South America and I feel free software can do a lot of
> good.  IMO, we've got to  have  that  on scope, all the time.  Also,

But what is keeping people into Microsft's slavery beng sucked of
their hard earned dollars and in exchange getting crap like Windows95
is the fact than the free software community has made few efforts in
issuing software for normal people.

Listen the goal of this project is _NOT_ spreading the Debian
distribution but the whole Linux by allowing non-computer oriented
people to use it.  I am not proposing we include anything proprietary,
I am not proposing we become Redhat pawns I am propsing to take the
shortest path, a path as GPLed as Debian.  And using RPM, using RedHat
or Caldera as starting point will not make us deviate from GPL or from
Linux: it will just make our job easier.

> many of these aspects I mention _could_ be derived from Debian's  so
> called  'social contract', as I understand it.  Having this in mind,
> and mentioning it to technical guys who, perhaps, haven't thought of
> these aspects, may be crucial for the moral and engagement spirit of
> many of 'our' hackers.  I'm pretty sure any hacker would feel damned
> proud to know 'his' system is  being used somewhere on the mountains
> of  Nepal  or  by  the  Food   and   Agriculture   Organization   in
> underdeveloped  countries  to,  say,  fight  off  erosion  and  seek
> groundwater, etc.;
> 

Listen you are convincing me than the Debian people should be shot
:-).  I had not realized the ampltude of their crimes :) : by issuing
a distribution completely unfit to non-programmers, by _not_ showing
the slightest intesrest in end users they are keeping thisrd world
people starving due to the impossibility of getting free software.  So
much better to please oneself and include a twentieth web server while
third world countries due to lack of people with a computing
background cannot use Linux+Andrew on an old 486 and must use
Windows95 and MS World on expensive hardware (a Pentium is one year
salary or more in third world).  But thinking about it the Debain
people should be shot at leat three times.  :-)


> (3).  About useful software applications: Don't worry, you'll get so
> many requests you'll many times fall asleep on the key-board :-)
> 

Please what about your test with Debian and end users? I am anxious
about their reactions when they will be proposed dozens of esoteric
programming languages, half a dozen web servers and no single half
decent Wysywyg.  I forgot about the DSELECT interface.  Ah because you
are living in Spain here is a spanish proverb: "Mas vale pajaro en
mano que ciento volando".  Better a bird in hand than one hundred
flying.


The goal of this project is making a _GPLed_ distribution of Linux
usable by end users to allow Linux spreading.  That is the point: the
status of the final product, than we go the Debian or the RPM way will
change nothing to that status.  But going the RPM way we will reach
our goal a year sooner.  So we will free third world a year sooner.
:-)

-- 
			Jean Francois Martinez

==================== The Linux.  Use the Linux, Luke! =======================

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