Re: [seul-edu] SEUL Licensing (was: Our presence at trade shows)

[Manuel Gutierrez Algaba <irmina@ctv.es>]

On Sat, 2 Sep 2000, Ray Olszewski wrote:
[ perfect understanding of hacker motivations snipped ]

> 
> I've never worked for an edsoft company, but I assume they staff with both
> experienced educators and skilled programmers, then do what is needed (pay
> them is the obvious starting point, but I expect there is more) to get them
> to work as a team.

Exactly.

> 
> Perhaps in addition to addressing the standard question of how to get
> programmers to produce code that gets distributed for free, the Open Source
> edsoft discussion should consider how to motivate teachers and programmers
> to collaborate in an Open Source setting. 

Sounds very appropiate and sensible!

> 
> programming; I don't recall ever seeing a programmer post asking for
> teachers to collaborate 

Well, I, programmer, asked for help for my Crosswords stuff, to get
people send me word definitions. I don't insist more in this because
I lack the time to retake it and release ...right now.

But, I think it's important to __gather__ __raw data__. If we 
have list of words, or stories described in some XML format,
if we get "unskilled" help in the form of stories, quizes ( in
XML format ),... we could create many programms.
Not everybody can programm in the required language, but everybody
can tell a story and he can get accostumed to put it in a bit
more formal way than natural language.

It's important to convince "unskilled" people, even kids, that
they can _work_ in their own tools providing raw data. Well, more
important it's to convice you all about what I mean :P. People have
strange ideas about what a programm should be. Nowadays, the concept
of "engine" ( graphical or not) feeded by _raw data_ gives good
result (think about Doom, Quake,.... saga). Or Microsoft flight 
simulator, ... in the end , _data_ is what makes the difference. 

> The cafeteria-manager program is the latest instance of this sort of
> request. Perhaps paying attention to how its team-building process works (or
> fails) will be instructive.

Well, Mysql, PHP, Apache is cool for hackers. I'd suggest create a 
sourceforge and ask for help. 

Finally, a metaphore. A true Computer Scientist is not a mathematician,
not a technician that wires here and there. A true Computer
Scientist is like a god that uses the existing matter ( data )
to create shapes and behaviours of those shapes. The more varied
the matter is, the more rich worlds we can create. The first step
is to create the matter and the reorganize it. But, If we come
to a place full of matter ready to be reorganized and shaped, we
can create lots of world in a blink. Lots of IT processes boil down
to reshape matter from one world to another.

If seul-edu could coordinate such effort of creating data in XML
for creating games on them, it'd be something far wiser than the 
accostumed hackerish mood of just adding more and more functionality
without knowing very well what is being built ( Mozilla, Gnome,
Gimp, emacs ...).

Currently, emacs is a text-only playstation and Mozilla pretends
to be an engine for games, if this is sensible, then  !!???

Regards/Saludos
Manolo
www.ctv.es/USERS/irmina    /TeEncontreX.html   /texpython.htm
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  O'Toole's commentary on Murphy's Law: Murphy was an optimist.